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Author Topic: Lighting  (Read 3475 times)
JL
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« on: July 06, 2010, 11:55:15 pm »

Hi All
I am just reassembling the front end of my car and getting the lights working. The question I have is regarding the fog/driving lights, at the moment I am not getting power to the lamp feed wire; I am assuming that they only work with either main or dip beam with the auxiliary light switch pressed but with the switch pressed (it does not illuminate – is this correct or is there another warning light?) I have no power on either main or dip beam. Are the lamps fed through a relay? I certainly cannot hear any clicking and there are no fuses blown.

Any ideas anyone?

Regards
John
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Anders Dinsen
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« Reply #1 on: July 07, 2010, 06:46:42 am »

The driving lights only work with the main beam on, so you need to turn on the headlinghts, and drop the arm down too to switch on main beam. The relay should click, provided the switch is depressed. There's no light in the switch, that's correct. Well there is, but probably long gone and only as a background illumination.

The lamps are fed through the fuse board relays, there are three relays: One for main, one for dipped beam and one for the driving lights. The fourth relay (if fitted) is driven from ignition and is for the electric windows.

I'd put my bet on a loose connection to the fuse board.

/Anders

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'82 Murena 2.2 prep 142
'01 Grand Espace 24v
'08 Smart Fortwo 0,8 cdi
JL
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« Reply #2 on: July 07, 2010, 11:18:49 pm »

Thanks Anders, I will check the fuseboard.
Regards
John
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JL
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« Reply #3 on: July 08, 2010, 11:23:32 pm »

The fault turned out to be a faulty relay, now sorted! Refitting the wings next.

John
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Anders Dinsen
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« Reply #4 on: July 09, 2010, 06:23:57 am »

Good to hear! Happy refitting  Smiley
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'82 Murena 2.2 prep 142
'01 Grand Espace 24v
'08 Smart Fortwo 0,8 cdi
suffolkpete
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« Reply #5 on: July 10, 2010, 02:14:46 pm »

Quote
The driving lights only work with the main beam on, so you need to turn on the headlights, and drop the arm down too to switch on main beam.
This arrangement is, strictly speaking, illegal in the UK as the lights are too close to the ground to be used as driving lights, they should only be used in fog or falling snow.  Many British owners have modified the wiring so that the lights work independently of main beam.  It involves moving one connector on the fuse panel.  Roy has published the details.  You should also have a warning light.  The tester actually checked this at my last MoT.
It sounds as though you are making good progress, I'm looking forward to seeing what seems like a very meticulous restoration.  Wobbly Wheel perhaps?
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JL
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« Reply #6 on: July 10, 2010, 10:31:51 pm »

Thanks for that information  Peter; I am hoping to be mobile during August, that will probably mean September but all being well I will try and get to the Wobbly Wheel.

Regards
John
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roy4matra
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« Reply #7 on: July 13, 2010, 01:04:20 pm »

Quote
The driving lights only work with the main beam on, so you need to turn on the headlights, and drop the arm down too to switch on main beam.

This arrangement is, strictly speaking, illegal in the UK as the lights are too close to the ground to be used as driving lights, they should only be used in fog or falling snow.

Not quite right Peter.  They are legal to be used with main beam as they switch off when you dip.  It is only if they are kept on when on dip or on their own that they are illegal except 'in fog or falling snow'.

Quote
Many British owners have modified the wiring so that the lights work independently of main beam.

This is when they become illegal to use as they are not switching off when you dip.  The reason behind this law is that very low front lamps can dazzle oncoming traffic as they don't have enough angle down.  Anyway lamps for fog or falling snow should be fog lamps i.e. with different glass fluting that gives short distance and wide spread.  Driving lamps like on the Murena have almost clear glass designed for less width but greater distance i.e. to aid main beam.

Quote
It involves moving one connector on the fuse panel.  Roy has published the details.  You should also have a warning light.  The tester actually checked this at my last MoT.

This is the other point, that to be used without the head lamps they must have a separate warning light.  But if they are only on with main beam and go off when you dip, then they are fine.

Roy
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suffolkpete
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« Reply #8 on: July 13, 2010, 03:47:16 pm »

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Anyway lamps for fog or falling snow should be fog lamps i.e. with different glass fluting that gives short distance and wide spread.
  Agreed, but I was moved to look up the Road Vehicles Lighting Regulations 1989 (how sad is that  Smiley?)  and the type of lens is not specified.  So it is legal to use the Murena driving lights with main beam, as you correctly state, but it is also legal to use them independently provided that there is a warning light and they are angled down by at least 3 deg.   I'm wondering now whether to unmodify my car back to the original spec although I did find the "fog light" mode very useful when driving back from Rogerthorpe in a blizzard last year!
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roy4matra
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« Reply #9 on: July 14, 2010, 12:50:42 am »

... but it is also legal to use them independently provided that there is a warning light and they are angled down by at least 3 deg.

Only if visibility is poor. Highway code rule 94 and 201.

The UK regulations state that head lamps must be between 500 mm and 1200 mm from the ground (to their lowest edge) and anything else becomes an auxiliary lamp.  Auxiliary lamps can be a max. of 1200 mm from the ground like head lamps but there is no minimum.

Auxiliary lamps can only be used in conditions of poor visibility (except when used as aux. main beam and go off when dipped).  Poor visibility is deemed to be less than 100 metres visibility.

Quote
I'm wondering now whether to unmodify my car back to the original spec although I did find the "fog light" mode very useful when driving back from Rogerthorpe in a blizzard last year!

I'm not sure how you have modified your lamps, but if you do them the way I have explained before in the magazine, they will function exactly as the standard car i.e. aux. driving lights with main beam, AND you can use them with side lamps only in poor visibility conditions.  So they are legal both ways.  And additionally they will come on automatically if ever the dipped beam failed as it once did on me, so it is a safety feature too!


As an aside here, when the dimensions were in inches, the head light minimum height was 24 inches to the centre of the lamp, so with the newer metric figures, head lights now can be slightly lower than before.

Roy
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suffolkpete
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« Reply #10 on: July 14, 2010, 08:57:19 am »

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Only if visibility is poor. Highway code rule 94 and 201.
Yes, I forgot to mention the bit about poor visibility.  I didn't modify the lamps myself.  When I bought the car there were two extra switches fitted on the dashboard.  With both switched on, one lamp would light with the headlamps on and when I dipped them it would go out and the other one came on  Huh  I corrected this, fitting warning lights for the cooling fan and the driving lights in the holes left and used the lamps as auxiliary lights.  Looks as if I may have to get the multimeter and wiring diagram out and re-visit them.  Thanks for that, another step on the road back to originality Smiley
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