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Author Topic: j63 starter function degraded and now not responding  (Read 335 times)
pduke
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« on: June 24, 2020, 09:50:42 pm »

I am opening a new topic every time but i believe it is more helpfull for the community. That is for the few of us left with a j63 ... Sad
So this could be a big one, but i hope it is just cables...

Notice: My battery is new, (BOSCH 63AH – A(EN) 610 S5005) and i test the car by jacking with another. Nothing changed.

It has been a while since the starter started misfunctioning in way. After a few days of inactivity it usually went like this:
1st try -> slow spinning of the engine (like uncharged battery) and stop
2nd try -> even slower
3rd try -> nothing, just a click sound
i let it for ~20 seconds
4th try -> Spin for a while and ...engine on (or sometimes needed a 5th try which was normal)

In those cases i then went for a small ride. When i parked it if i let it for a few minutes and then gave it a try it started normally.
The above procceedure began to worsen the last weeks.

Now i am in a state where nothing happens.I uploaded a video, it has sound (little icon on the right).

You can see the two red lights fade a bit when the key goes full turn so i assume that power is working.
I have no further knowledge of what could be wrong except of a faulty starter or ... cables misplaced(?)
Unfortunatelly the starter is placed in a very difficult to reach position so i can't even take a look at the wiring.Is there a way except of taking it on a ramp?

I 've found a few posts in this forum, usually for murena, some cases was the wiring but still i don't know where to start. Should i check the fuses?

i may have tire you all with all my problems but ... i love this car and i start to believe that it is dying on me... 



cheers all
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mhi
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« Reply #1 on: June 24, 2020, 10:47:02 pm »

The starter motor failed in my J636 three years ago, at 188490 miles or 303345 km. If yours is somewhere near that age, you may well have the same failure. A voltmeter can confirm that the starter is receiving most of the battery's 12 volts, and in my case the car push-started easily (it's petrol/gasoline, not diesel) so finished its day's work with help from a few volunteers.

I paid my usual garage mechanic to replace the starter motor. You're right that it is difficult to get at! Description is in the Vault file MR299espace1.pdf. The starter has 4 carbon brushes, and I think mine had been operating on just 2 of them for a year before it failed. The new one was much better than the original had been a week earlier.

 - Mark
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1994 Espace RXE 2.0 (J636)
pduke
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« Reply #2 on: June 25, 2020, 02:21:20 pm »

The starter motor failed in my J636 three years ago, at 188490 miles or 303345 km. If yours is somewhere near that age, you may well have the same failure. A voltmeter can confirm that the starter is receiving most of the battery's 12 volts, and in my case the car push-started easily (it's petrol/gasoline, not diesel) so finished its day's work with help from a few volunteers.

I paid my usual garage mechanic to replace the starter motor. You're right that it is difficult to get at! Description is in the Vault file MR299espace1.pdf. The starter has 4 carbon brushes, and I think mine had been operating on just 2 of them for a year before it failed. The new one was much better than the original had been a week earlier.

 - Mark
i am at 205k km but i guess it is the way time passes through a car's life and the way the car was used.
Thanks for the tip, found the page, i need a mechanic... Tongue

BUT! UPDATE
Today it is cloudy with slight rain. Humidity. So i gave it a try. Unfortunatelly, i didn't bring my camera.
1st try -> an electric "chuck" sound
2nd try -> An ill hyper slow cough every second or more ... i let it three times
3rd try -> accelerated spinning and .... TaDa!! engine on...

Does this mean something or i am just lost in useless details when i should just be replacing the starter?
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Anders Dinsen
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« Reply #3 on: June 25, 2020, 03:54:52 pm »

Does this mean something or i am just lost in useless details when i should just be replacing the starter?

Cheesy

I'd say you're getting lost here, and need a new starter.

/Anders
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'82 Murena 2.2 prep 142
'01 Grand Espace 24v
'08 Smart Fortwo 0,8 cdi
Anders Dinsen
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« Reply #4 on: June 25, 2020, 03:56:26 pm »

Does this mean something or i am just lost in useless details when i should just be replacing the starter?

Cheesy

I'd say you're getting lost here, and need a new starter.

/Anders

I miss my old J11 when I see your dash Smiley

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'82 Murena 2.2 prep 142
'01 Grand Espace 24v
'08 Smart Fortwo 0,8 cdi
pduke
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Posts: 44



« Reply #5 on: June 25, 2020, 10:24:39 pm »

Does this mean something or i am just lost in useless details when i should just be replacing the starter?

Cheesy

I'd say you're getting lost here, and need a new starter.

/Anders

I miss my old J11 when I see your dash Smiley

Smiley i ve been there ..
so what is going on with starters market ?
i found this Valeo for 85 euros in a store near me ....
https://www.autodoc.co.uk/valeo/7003309
this is nuts!

plus, could this not be the starter? cause the bill is starting going up here and i have a sound from the steering shaft or the suspension ... and.... today i found a 2.8v6 with 33k km that hasn't move since 96 ... and i am thinking about buying it for parts .....  Roll Eyes  Shocked i mean the interior is like new!! Shocked Shocked
talking about getting lost ... omg
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roy4matra
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« Reply #6 on: June 26, 2020, 12:52:55 am »


It has been a while since the starter started misfunctioning in way. After a few days of inactivity it usually went like this:
1st try -> slow spinning of the engine (like uncharged battery) and stop
2nd try -> even slower
3rd try -> nothing, just a click sound
i let it for ~20 seconds
4th try -> Spin for a while and ...engine on (or sometimes needed a 5th try which was normal)

cheers all

Whilst it could be the starter motor needs to be replaced, the very first thing you should do is to check all the earths and especially the earth braid from the engine to the chassis.

Obviously you have an earth lead from the battery negative to the chassis, and you should check that but the earth braid is just as important, as it completes the block earth to the chassis and back to the battery.  A poor earth will give the same sluggish engine turn over or just a click from the solenoid as a flat battery or poor starter.

Roy
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pduke
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« Reply #7 on: July 06, 2020, 10:01:29 am »

I still wasn't able to get underneath the car to check the starter but I have a suspition about the strange behaviour. There is a leak from the rubber washer that seals the big screw of the driver's wiper. Actually the washer is in pretty bad condition. It is too large, old and loose, not the original i assume. So it leaks on to the engine just above the spot where i believe it is the starter underneath.(just near the last engine beck)
For the last 2 weeks it is working fine, the weather was dry all days.
I could be wrong, but i deffinitely have to replace the washer or make a custom one.
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mhi
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« Reply #8 on: July 06, 2020, 01:16:46 pm »

... There is a leak from the rubber washer that seals the big screw of the driver's wiper....
My wipers have very worn pivots, even the replacements I got in 2015. There's an old topic about this at http://www.matrasport.dk/forum/index.php/topic,2928.0.html.

 - Mark
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1994 Espace RXE 2.0 (J636)
pduke
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Posts: 44



« Reply #9 on: July 30, 2020, 08:18:32 pm »

My wipers have very worn pivots, even the replacements I got in 2015. There's an old topic about this at http://www.matrasport.dk/forum/index.php/topic,2928.0.html.

 - Mark
.

i haven't forgetten this onei have read all the topic. I found the correct bushes and everything, but for know i have worst things in line...
Funny thing, from the day my last post in this topic was wrote, the starter is working fine. I am using the car much often 1 -2 days tops, so i am pretty relieved in that matter. Of course it may do it again, but for now it works like it never had a problem ...
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