MatraSport Forum

anyone know of this? if the centerconsole is done with space for a matrix?

theres however space for a long and small matrix by the feets and a radial fan fitted behind.

its pretty easy to work a ac (been working with it some time) so it should be a pretty easy fit on a murena

And where to put the compressor for it? And those long pipes to compressor - cooler - A/C unit, etc...?

That should certainly be possible. Here's a link to a kit used by kit car builders in the UK:

http://www.cbsonline.co.uk/universal-air-conditioning--heater-kit-aircon-294-p.asp

Running pipes under the car isn't a problem on the Murena any more than other mid engined cars. It's frequently done with mid engined kit cars like the Ultima GTR.

This is just to show that it can be done - the kit above is a bit pricey IMO ;)

/Anders

I guess you could use the compressor and brackets from the peugeot 505 turbo if it will fit in the engine bay.
But the pipes and are gonna be a bitch to run along the bottom of the car.. and the condenser will restrict the airflow to the radiator.

Considering the type of vehicle a murena is I wouldnt bother..

Approximately 50 Murenas were exported to Japan, and they were all fitted with AC by the Japanese import company.
I had some years back some correspondence with a Japanese guy (living in the US at the time, if I remember correctly) who had a “Japanese” Murena, but the AC in his car had been removed, and he did not have any documentation or pictures of the installation.

So AC in a Murena: It can be done and it has been done!

Hans

I'm sure theres a car in the UK with AC, i think it was sold on Fleabay last year.. Maybe its a MEC member... I think Roy would know about this one..

so the centercoole is prepared for an extra matrix or the whole package is swaped? 

the engine is a xu9j4 (16v) and has compressor mountingholes.
(but mounting a magnetic compressor on a non ac-engine cant be so hard.)

but I was more thinking in having either the condensor in the back at the end of the storagebox or where the spare tire usually is.  using long pipes aint a problem

a manually ac only need a on off, 2 preassure switches, dry filter and a vaporator.   and of course the matrix and condenser.   

hmm  maybe a project in 6month? :)

Sure.. if you use the car alot... if you only drive it for fun.. I still think its just dead weight on an allready heavy car.... and more things to go wrong of cause :)

Exactly - my way of thinking is: how to make it lighter? But everything will be visible and won't be in harmony with original codition :(

ohh  sorry mr. original who never cuts his hair or mustach  ;D

the question was never about origionality of the car itself, just the ac and its possibility ;)

No no, I was not talking about originality this time ;) I only said that I agree with Krede that if it could be done, it means a lot of kgs plus. And what is more important at sportcar than power/weight ratio?  ;)

I would love an AC in my Murena too. But I am not prepared to try to fit a traditional AC unit, because of the extensive mechanical modifications that are required.

On the other hand, I may try an alternative solution, using a number of peltier elements. I have five peltier elements, each 4 square inches big. I am thinking of creating a duct where they are mounted, dividing the duct in two, with some serious heat sinks on each side. Then blow air from the cold side into the car and venting the hot side to the outside. Right now it is just a thought, no serious planning has taken place, but I have studied the possibilities and challenges involving peltier elements.

One thing seems sure, it will require replacing the alternator with a heavy duty model (80 amps or so). How much cold air can be created this way is yet to be calculated, but since you can buy (beer) coolers, ;D based on the peltier principle, that plugs into the cigarette lighter in cars, then it seems that the solid state AC is a possibility. At least it can keep my beer cold ;D ;D ;D

not a bad idea considering the cockpit is very small in a murena, needing less cold air to cool.

but 5x75w elements is alot :D    375w total but I know mondeo 94 has a 90amp generator.  however in your case you could use the existing heater and run cool water in it!

go for it  ;D

Oskar, you are a genious.  8) I should have thought of that myself.

The best way to do this is to put a bypass valve into water line for the heater, so that it is possible to circulate a small amount of water through the heater and cooling it with a peltier unit under the hood. No extra holes to cut in the firewall for air ducts. It will be clean and simple. You just moved this from wishfull thinking, to a definite project. Now if I can just make it cool my beer too.  ;D ;D ;D ;D

Hello, I'm new to this forum.  My Murena had a cooler unit (not a complete AC) ,
obviously attached when it was brought in Japan by somebody (the importer, maybe). 
It worked well, but since the unit was designed for right-hand driver cars, the knobs
were placed on the right hand side of the unit.  The unit was set in front of
the passenger by removing the hanging shelf, so the knobs were way to far to reach. 
The compressor was located near the right rear driving axle mounted via hand-made
steel plate and welded pulley.  I  had to remove the compressor when I changed
the exhaust to MatraMagic stainless one from the rusted original because they
interfered.  The cooler united consumed quite a lot of power and driving performance
was deteriorated, apparently, so then, why just drive a Corolla.  I'm glad now
being in California - I don't need an AC.  Hisashi

Hi Hisashi,
Welcome. You are new to this form but you are certainly not new to the Murena as I have seen your name years back in other forums.

Regards Hans

 

Hisashi, welcome to the forum! Good to have your input here and on this thread. I hope all is well with you and your Murena!

/Anders

think im going for the same setup
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k2pvo00Cq4c

how much does power (amps) does the car demands simultainiously, 150w 200w?

say 450w peltier and then a  650/12= 55amp generator is needed.  hmm
and a waterpump 50w..   

Welcome Hisashi

photos of your Murena?

Just keep in mind that a Peltier is not very economic with energy.
If you take a Peltier of about 450 W consumed power, there wil be only about 250 W cooling energy left.
That is not much to cool the car, so you need al last 2, wich come to 900 Watt and 500 usefull Watts..
At 13 Volt that will be P=UxI = 900=13xI    I= 69 Amp.
You need serious wiring and a powerfull generator.
Also 2 very big heatsinks.
a lot of heat is generated at the other side of the Peltier.
How do you get rid of that?

I use a Awco to cool. (All Windows Can Open)

 ;D ;D ;D You want to kill me today?  ;D ;D ;D AWCO  ;D ;D ;D

Slightly off topic, but AWOC + SFO (sunroof fully open) would suit me ;D

Both Bagheeras that I owned had large fabric sunroofs which were almost as good as a targa top.  I have a dreadful, leaky glass sunroof on my murena which is pretty useless. 

Has anyone fitted a fabric type sunroof to a murena?  A removable roof panel would also be worth considering...

Some years ago i made a mini fridge by using a peltier element.  A total failure!
The peltier element get realy hot on one side, and very cold at the other side. The peltier element is just a few millimeter thick. So there is just a small space between the hot and cold area.  The problem i had is to make proper heat isolation. Keeping the heat away from the cold.  A big part of the heat was heating up the surrounding of the peltier. The heatsink on the inside of the fridge was realy cold, but the heatsink on the outside was heating up the housing of the fridge.

Result:  the temperature of the fridge has raise a little after 30 minutes of heavy power consumption.

Hi Bart.
I am aware of the challenges using peltier elements. The problems you encountered are "standard", yet there are portable coolers using peltier elements, that work quite well.

The challenge is to move the heat and cold from the heatsinks and Oskar provided the idea for the solution earlier in this thread. By using water cooled heatsinks, I plan to transport the cold into the Murena's heater core where the blower will dissipate it in the cabin. The heat I plan to send to a second heater core element placed out in front of the radiator. Thermostats and electric pumps should ballance the whole setup.