MatraSport Forum

Hi, I am from Serbia, so do not learn english from me... :)  My espace has auto gearbox....code for this box is DPO 005. I went to my mehanic and change transmision oil, but there is the problem, because that car with this box is rear in our country and there is not data for it. please help.....how mach oil should I put in the box? We tried with 5 liters, but it when I drive in town, sometime I put it in D and it selects 3. gear and steys in it all the time. Then I have to stop and turn off engine....after 2 min. it is o.k......I is hepening when engine is warm. PLEASE HELP>>>>

5 liters is probably too much, You should fill up with the amount drained + 0.5 liters (normally approx 4 liters -depending on the amount in the gearbox), then read gearbox oil temperature with diagnostic tool - when gearbox oil is ~ 60*c , open the smallest sump plug (inner plug - there is a levelling tube inside)
If no oil is coming out, add 0.5 liters and redo procedure.
If oil is flowing out, let it flow until it starts to drip (temp ~ 60*c) - then level is ok.

Reset auto adaptive memory + reset oil counter with diagnostic tool to tell it that it has new oil !

O.K. but  what abauth problem when I put it in D....? Why it selects 3. gear.....?

Hi Marko, the oil was drained from my DP0-005 just last week, about 3 liters came out.
the total capicity of the transmission is 6 liters but only half of that will come out when you remove the drain plug.
If you have filled with 5 liters then you'll have 8 liters in there now.
 I'd reccomend not using the car untill it's drained down to the correct level, better safe than sorry. The problem you describe could be due to too much oil/ incorrect oil pressure now.

when the engine is warm, take out the level plug ( the smallest one ) with the engine idling. At normal engine temperatures the transmission oil will be about the correct temperature.

if you need to add oil you can just pump it thru a tube up the drain tube/ level plug hole if your garage has the right equipment. I guess you know the reccomended oil is Elf Reanultmatic D3 syn.

good luck

the oil is D3 and I removed level plug, and have done it write, but the still the same..... and it happens when I try to park, I mean D, R, N, D, R..... and it started to do that since temperatures are under 0....... I don not now.... Can it be a problem with gearbox ECU?

3'rd gear is "safe mode" to make sure you can drive to the nearest worshop when a problem occurs with the transmission.

Try to take off and on the connector to the transmission computer - then check wiring - but ofcourse the best approach is to read out faultcodes.

There is also a potmeter-switch (gear selector switch) that perhaps needs to be calibrated.

Does this box have filter...?

Yes - but it is not accessable as far as i know and is supposed to live "forever" like the oil ::)

xaxaxaaa..... :D   that is stupid.....

nothing is FOREVER..... ZF says for their boxes the same..... I think you have 4HP20..... am I write...? And your filter is easy to reach.... I think......

hei Marko, in response to your PM, I haven't had any trouble with the trans in my espace which has 86000km on the clock now.
I guess as long as you change the oil occasionally, say every 2 years at least, and don't tow anything with the car it should be trouble free. It has very smooth gear shifts.
there are some documents available with some detail of the trans.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/6338026/AL4-Transmission   (this is the citroen version of the same unit)
http://www.matrasport.dk/Cars/Espace/vault/JE/3219A_JE_F4R.pdf

the filters are visable under the oil pump and in the valve block

the 4HP20 oil filter is inside the gearbox aswell, only way to change is by splitting the gearbox. Easier on the DP0 box.

You have a fault on the box, it could be wiring problem, valve problem, oil problem or sensor problem. It takes knowledge to get it right, but its a good gearbox if maintained correctly. I have a Scenic with 225.000km and 2.0 16v (F4R) on DP0 - working just fine. Flushed 4 times with D3 synt oil this summer due to hard gearchanges, after that it have been shifting nice and smooth even in -20*c and cold gearbox.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH.....  ;D my box is now o.k.......it works just fine..... data and advises you gave helped me a lot. I am teacher in high school, but now, with some tools, I can be SPECIALIST for DPO in my country....... Thank you one more time...!  ;)   

What was the problem ?

At first to much oil.....  ;D and after leveling it write..... it needed 2-3 days to start working normally.... I think that extra oil coses same faults in ECU, now all is write and sensors give god informations.... and I saw a leak near flayweal from box.... It start to put it out....but now it is O.K. no damage! Thank you one more time.... I can't survive to take out auto and put manual box.I like my DPO 005 to much  ;) Is their something more on what I should pay attention?

Drain and fill it with D3 oil every 30.000km and it will "live forever" ;D

O.k.....Thanks

       ...well, if you are intending to keep the car for a long time then it's probably a good idea to change the coolant / antifreeze. Not just to achieve the correct protection in the cold, but mainly to reduce deposits and sludge / sediment buildup so you can avoid ever having a blocked heater core. There are several ways to flush and get the final mix correct. Coolant is cheap considering the protection it gives, but maybe it's best to do it outside in the summer.
         Previously, I've just taken the lower radiator hose off and let the fluid drain out, then topped it up; every 2 years. 6.5 liter is replaced this way.

However this year I'm considering
1. draining the system and filling it with only water.
2. Then flushing and replacing the water a few times over a period of a few days
3. draining out half the water when the flushing is complete.
4. filling with 4.5 liter antifreeze ( or whatever half the volume is )

         That's what I've done on other vehicles that weren't easy to drain, maybe others who've done this at home have better suggestions.

Thanks for advice......I will start to do that...it's the only way to do it properly.....

"Reset auto adaptive memory + reset oil counter with diagnostic tool"

I've been driving with new fluid in the trans for 2 months now.
I plan to get the oil age counter reset tomorrow at a renault dealer, however I cant find any written instructions on how to do it.
the only thing I've found out is to enter the date of oil change by entering command G74.

are the autoadaptive memory and oil counter 2 different things?

Yes, with CLIP or NXR enter Programming/Configuration section in gearbox computer and follow instructions on each task.
G74 command is if using the old XR25 diagnostic tool and very few dealers have this one, in Norway anyways.

After resetting autoadaptive parameters you should drive it "smooth and light" up and down through all gearchanges several times and the computer will adapt itself to suit the actual state of gearbox.

 the CLIP seemed to be fairly self explanitory, even in Swedish so the counter has been set to 0 since the car has not been driven far since it was refilled in february 2010 and the autoadaptive parameters memory was deleted.
       One fault code was present on the trans: 18D input speed sensor. After reseting that it didn't return straight away at least, so I guess I can allways check again in a month or two and see if the fault code has returned.
    It's not easy to say if there was any noticable difference in smoothness in the first hour, but after a couple of hours of spirited driving on winding country roads I think the trans is shifting as smoothly as it ever has, and I've had the Espace since it had 32,000km / 19,000 miles on the clock. Now it has 88k km / 53k miles.
    One thing that seems to be different is the unneccessary downshifting from 4 to 3 has improved. Previously if I just thought of braking for a traffic camera, or on a downhill slope under 80 km/h the trans would often shift down from 4 -3. Now I can brake quite a bit in 4th gear before the trans will shift down to 3 which is much better.
     so I guess my conclusion is it probably is a good idea to reset the oil counter and memory after an oil change.

Marko, how is your auto trans now after it was overfilled?

It was probably designed -and described by Renault -like this for a reason. But i dont think it is common practice to do it!

no you are right, the 3 auto trans specialists that I have spoken to in Norway and sweden regarding oil change said they don't reset anything.
      I don't have any specific measurements or data, but after in town driving today I just "feel" that the box is behaving well and is as as smooth as it gets.     
                ...the oil is not Elf renaultmatic D3 however. 

        I plan to do a 3.5 liter oil change every second year or 20,000km in the future. It should be checked for oil level anyway so I might as well just take out the drain tube and fill in an extra 3 liters while the car is up in the air.         
       ...Unless we win in lotto in the meantime of course, because then I'll be driving a new black 3.5 liter espace with gold trim package and lots of buttons and flashing LEDs or bells & whistles as one says in the UK.

Similar to my way, but still it would be unlightly that i would sell the JE - it is someting magic about them ::) and magic cars are not made anymore

you're right it would be wrong to sell it. I think I'd send it on a return trip to california to be pimped instead.

I hope some one might find this posting . It is clearly the best for espaces.Iam changing my alternator and on removing the plastic sump shield I was alarmed to see that my auto gear box was leaking around the two main gaskets. I have  owned a 2006  2.0T auto. for 10 months.THe gear box drives well and there are no warning messages appearing although there is a higher pitched sound when firstst gear is engaged.I have never noticed a leak before beccause the leaking fluid has collected on the sump guard.Not only was there the leak but around both mating surfaces there was  badly apllied gasket sealant which resembled the old red hermetite.I am wondering if the car has been the subject of poor warranty work.Perhaps the original gaskets were not replaced. I don't propose spending a fortune having the box taken out so that the askets can be replaced.But i will need to check the fluid level. Will the procedure g iven in this thraed work well enough to avoid repeated checks by Renault,Could you give more details about using the filling tube.I do have a couple of old syringes if these would be of help

yes you can check the oil level yourself.

1.  buy a liter of full synthetic dexron III fluid, preferably the brand specified by renault, I think its called Elf renaultmatic D3 syn.
2.  drive the car for a while so that the motor and gearbox are up to full working temperature
3.   lift up the car, it must be completely level.
4.   Take out the level plug only from the bottom of the transmission,  there is what appears to be a plug within a plug. The fill plug is the smaller one. Only a few drips will come out when you remove that one.
5. The oil should be at 68 degrees C, to get the correct level measurement so check it as soon as possible after you've warmed up the car.
6. no matter what the level is, you need to overfill it untill it runs out. Filling up thru the level plug should go ok with syrynges, but you'll need a hose on the end about 12mm dia.  I have used just a standard oil can with a hose on other cars.
7. Its best to over fill with half a liter and then start the motor and run thru the gears.
8. afterwards, take out the level plug once more and let the excess run out.

because your transnmission may have leaked for a while, step 7-8 are important. You may need to add more fluid. If the trans is leaking fluid, then you can take it to any transmission specialist and they can do it for you. They'll have filling equipment ready to do it quickly so it shouldn't cost too much. If the level is down then you'l just have to get it checked more often. The most important thing is that the level is correct, not which brand of fluid you choose.

you can of course fill in the top of the trans thru the fill port if that's easier than spending time under the car.