MatraSport Forum

has any one fitted azev type 'a' 15 x7 with 205 50r15 and 225 50r15 to a murena2.2 which has been lowerd . will they rub , would the rears be to big?
i seen a picturehttp://www.matrasport.dk/Cars/Murena/Gallery1/Med/bs_008.jpg whot size tyres are on that?


or whot else is anyone using?


Regards Darren

Those on the photo look like 16" to me.
If you keep the offset right on the rims, I think you should be safe with the tyre sizes you mention, even on a lowered car. AFAIK there's a good deal of space in the wheel arches to accomodate larger tyres.

I have tires into 235/40R17 for the back and 215/40R17 for the front

(http://i23.servimg.com/u/f23/09/01/17/84/imgp7610.jpg) (http://www.servimg.com/image_preview.php?i=742&u=10011784)

on the other hand at late I put a spacer of 10 millimetres if not the tire rubs the arm
(http://i18.servimg.com/u/f18/09/01/17/84/th/imgp2710.jpg) (http://www.servimg.com/image_preview.php?i=666&u=10011784)

I think its a shame to fit such big rimmes on an old car.... well on any car really... :)... but Im old fasioned

Sorry, but 17" are too big...  ;)

has any one got any pictures of azev 15 fitted ? and whot size tyres and et are they

thanks darren

Go to the Murena gallery, and look for Lennarts silver 1.9... It has 15" Azevs fitted I believe.

http://www.matrasport.dk/Cars/Murena/Gallery1/Med/dsc_5425.html

Looks much better then 17" IMHO..

Azev-A Indeed.
- however the rear suspension is 1" too high on my car (the "late 1.6 syndrome), so the wheels are not centered in the wheel-arc. I am getting new springs and shocks on it now - which should put the suspension down where it belongs. Should be good.

/Lennart

You can never agree on looks and taste, and old wheels can allways be refitted - please do as you like.

However, there are some practical points to consider:

Width and offset: Standard is 195 mm and 25 mm. This mean 122,5 mm goes inside and 72,5 mm goes outside relative to connection surface on the brake disc, which is fixed. Inside is a small clearance between tire and travelling arm, so do not exceed 130 mm.

Tire profile: Standard is 60%. The suspension, damping, weight and tire profile together makes a suspention system. If you change one or more of them, they might get out of balance. This could cause poor handling. I have experienced this on a X 1/9.

Offset: Some use distance discs to compensate for 35 mm offset (FIAT) or to extend the track. If you change the offset, you put non designed stress to the bearings.

Tire sizes: You may experience, that the ideal tire set for the Murena is not available.

But most important: SAFETY FIRST
17" rims - I would imagine, does conflict with some of the above.

Welcome on board  ;)


That's true!

Quote
-------
SAFETY FIRST
-----------------
100% agreed.
If you don't need to go to circuits keep suspension and tyres original.
Aldo other wheels en extreme sizes of that wheels can look stunning on the car, I believe it doesn't do the handling on open road any good.
Aquaplaning and unpredictable behavior is not something I want.
I stick to the originals wich suits the car pretty good.

I agree totally with you there. A 60-profile sidewall is quite soft and deflects quite a lot in lateral acceleration (i.e. cornering). Even the 55-profile's I run at the front are much stiffer than the standard 60's I have on the rear. This was recommended to me by Roy who experienced quite a decent handling improvement when he switched. As I haven't tried anything else, I can't compare, but I find it performs well both on my Yokohama summer tires and Pirelli winter tires. So it appears, that this particular change is within the practical range of improvements. I'd guess that the 50-profiles that a 15" rim would necessitate would also give a slight improvement in performance.

If I had the money to experiment (or a tyre sponsor?) it could be interesting to do some tests with different tyre profiles and sizes.


Unfortunately AFAIK, distance rings are illegal in this country?


What exactly do you mean?


Agree ;)

phil75, what kind of rims are those on your car? I think they look rather nice on it, altough not the 80s-look as the car is.

Ive got coil overs all the way around, it quite stiff but its still good on a long journey. the handling is much better and turns in nice when going quickly.

When I first got my Murena it had 20 mm spacers for all 4 wheels with its original rims.
I drove with the spacers fitted for some weeks. However the first time I made a sharp turn and braked at the same time one of the front tires took out a big part of the front wing. (I wanted to turn around and go back).
The spacers was taken off immediately and has newer been installed since, (but I still the parts in a box in my workshop should any body be interested).
I guess that the previous owner had newer been driven the Murena with the spacers on, as he as a student had spent his money on a spoiler kit and a re-spray from silver to red. When the car failed the TüV inspection due to rust in the rear suspension, his bank account was empty, and the Murena was parked for 8 years untill I purchased it.

regards Hans

but I still the parts in a box in my workshop should any body be interestedI hope nobody here are foolish enough to fit spacers!!.. As you rightly say Hans... they can be very dangerous....not to mention harmful to your wheel bearings etc.

Spacers on original wheels are a crazy idea.  They should only be used to bring the offset back to what it should be if you fit wheels with a non-standard offset.  If you do that and fit wheel bolts with the appropriate length then they should be safe.

Alessio Action
http://www.gtasport.com/alessio-action-p-350.html

for me spacers (with ring of centering) of only 10 mm with adapted bolts

does anyone know what size these are? 15?

At least 16.

I imagine these would fit - comes in 7,5x16 - 4x98
ET25 should be acceptable

http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=290200864610&ih=019&category=9888

(http://i13.ebayimg.com/08/i/000/d4/bf/d5c0_1_sbl.JPG)

I agree, and as they are for Fiats, the hub diameter will be right too - or suitable adapter will be supplied.

But I'd personally aviod rims this large as with a 16x7.5 rim will have to fit 205/40's on the front. That's a very low profile for the Murena and I think it will make the ride a good deal too harsh. Such a wide tyre will also pick up a lot of road squatter on the light fronted Murena.

Also remember, modern cars have very soft bushings in the suspension, wheas our cars have solid rubber bushings - not as uncomfortable as PU-bushings, but one can't rely on them to absorb much. But some people do run on these and are apparantly happy with the result! And the looks are 'potent' ;)

I think the Lotus Europa S is fitted with 195's on the front and 225 on the rear by the way. It has a similar weight distribution as the Murena. Has anyone here tried one, by the way (off topic, I know)

what adapter is needed? for the ET or centerhub?
Im in need for new wheels  :)

and according to wheelcalculate will 205/50-16 be the same as 195/60-15

Centre hub - it's a plastic ring.


Well you have the wrong rim diameter there. Original Murena 2.2 wheels are 185/60-14 front and 195/60-14 rear.
I'm  using the tools on http://www.carbibles.com/tyre_bible.html (http://www.carbibles.com/tyre_bible.html)

- Anders

I like the look with 50' tyres - to me 40 is to low, makes it look like something from a bicycle :-)

Using 205/50x16 would give a change of diameter in 3.7% - which is acceptable.

I don't think that my murena resembles a bicycle  ;D ;D

(http://i24.servimg.com/u/f24/09/01/17/84/dsc04114.jpg) (http://www.servimg.com/image_preview.php?i=1030&u=10011784)

Nono, its a quadcycle :D

Ups, Phil - Sorry if I hurt you there  :-[ :-[ :-[
Are they 17" rims ?

you don't have me hurt, I laugh


Yes
Front 215/40R17
Rear 235/40R17

:D :D :D

Let me join the discussion...

First of all someone quoted the wrong orig. wheel dimensions for the murena.
They correct dimensions are:
14x6" ET28

Also would people please incl. their offset when suggesting wheels that could be use.

I was looking to use 15x6" on the front and 16x6.5" rear.
Therefore I have bought a set of 16x6.5" ET25 that I was planning to use, but the rims are no longer availible in 15".
The ET25 offset results in pretty much the perfect fit with the 6.5" width.

If anyone are looking for new wheels, you can use the Fiat Barchetta as reference, as they have roughly the same data as our Murena's...

They are for sale in case anyone in Denmark are looking from new wheels?
It's the SMC type Z in silver...
http://www.gumibolt.hu/alufelni/fenykepek/Z.jpg

looking for 2.000 DKK (270€) for the 4 rims.
They are brand new and incl. mounting bolts etc.

Should fit nicely with the following choice of tires:
Front                                  Rear
185/50-16  (+2.4%)           195/50-16 (+2%)
195/40-16  (-2.6%)            205/50-16 (+3.7%)
195/45-16   (+0.75%)        205/45-16 (+0.2%)

Regards,
Valdemar

Correct dimension is not ET28 but ET29

(http://i41.servimg.com/u/f41/09/01/17/84/et10.jpg) (http://www.servimg.com/image_preview.php?i=2020&u=10011784)

Phil - is your car lowerd at the back?

No, the height is of origin to the rear (Front is also with the height of origin)

http://img525.imageshack.us/my.php?image=dsc02456cl7.jpg

I fit those wheels under my car ;AEZ Xylo      4x98 - ET 28 - 15"- 58,1 mm and 6.5 J
and my car is lowerd about 25mm back and 15 mm front
Tyres  front 195x 50  back 225 x 50

That would be my choice of sizes on 15" rims

will these rims fit ?
http://cgi.ebay.com/15-Rapid-Alloy-wheels-FIAT-PUNTO-4-Stud-4x98-114-NEW_W0QQitemZ350044840787QQihZ022QQcategoryZ28648QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD2VQQcmdZViewItem?_trksid=p1638.m122

(http://i2.ebayimg.com/02/i/000/cc/f4/6df9_1.JPG)

Yes, they should be ok.

i Got some wheels at last , taken me meny years to decide what to get 

Very nice too. I think I see something lurking behind them that's looks a bit cutting edge?

How about some pictures of them front and rear?

GP

Hi Darren.

Wheels look good.  :D
Tell me what kind of brake caliper is it that I see on one of the photos. Did you have to make any modifications to the mounting points and disk?

Regards.
Jon.

i use 4 piston front calipers radial mount and 4 piston rear calipers with handbrake lug mount, 315mm front discs and 300mm rear

More pictures of the rear end please!

GP

You can find the suplier of the brakes here: http://www.hispecbrake.co.uk/

I belive that the one Alfa V6 in Denmark is equiped with Hi Spec Brakes

Hans

I see vented disks too.  ;D
Did you use a kit? and in that case what is the part number?

I looked at hispecbrakes.co.uk but I did not see any parts mentioning Matra. or Murena.

Regards.
Jon

yes vented discs all round and no its not a kit and theres only just clearance for the 16 inch wheels , ive just done some pictures but with my phone for now

Nice job, I am very envious.
I do like the fact that with the external bells you can remove the discs without pulling the assembly apart and dropping ball bearings all over the floor.
How does the brake pedal feel with the extra volume of fluid that requires displacing, assuming that you still have the original brake master cylinder?
Have you removed the pressure reducing valve in the rear and fitted a brake bias valve in the front circuit also?
GP

Could you give the part numbers or names that you used for your brake system? Did you have to make your own adaptor-plates to get the brakes fitted??

I am looking for a good set of brakes for the Murena, and this looks very promising!

hi,

The brake discs for the Murena are original 240 MM at the front and 260 mm at the rear.

Yours are much bigger, especially the front brakes.

Can you tell me something about your experiences with those big brakes?  The brake at the rear is limited because off the brake pressure valve, so that won't give any problems.
But the front brakes are big for a car who has the engine in the back. How are the brakes holding at the highway(for exemple 120Miles/h)?

And when the road is wet, do the front wheels easily block?

I think it's a nice set  of brakes for the Murena.

Maybe something for my Matra Murena 2.3 16V  Turbo ?

Gideon

i have replaced the rear brake pressure valve in the rear for an adjustible one , hidden under the brake master cylinder, i havent done meny miles yet and the ones i have done were in the dry,i wanted bigger brakes becouse the standard brakes are not suitable for track days . ive got 16 inch wheels and track day tyres which seem to be good  for fast road , iam yet to find out what they are like on track