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Author Topic: Pics of Murena Turbo  (Read 16303 times)
Matra_Hans
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Owner of Bagheera, Rancho, Murena & Espace


« Reply #15 on: October 09, 2008, 12:56:32 pm »

... the first american version of the 505 turbo had only 155 HP!!
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RazorbackNOR
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« Reply #16 on: October 09, 2008, 02:07:30 pm »

Somebody should blow the dust of the old plans and now make the Murena V12  Grin Grin
Or make the "NEW" Murena sportscar!!
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2010 Mazda 3 1,6  Diesel Gunmetal Blue
1983 Matra Murena 2.2 Platine
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RazorbackNOR
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« Reply #17 on: October 13, 2008, 07:05:07 pm »

Should had gotten hold of an wrecked 505Ti, delivered the engine to a tuner and gotten him to draw all that was possible out of it before fitting it on the Murena  Grin
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2010 Mazda 3 1,6  Diesel Gunmetal Blue
1983 Matra Murena 2.2 Platine
50cc Pocketbike
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michaltalbot
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« Reply #18 on: October 13, 2008, 09:11:20 pm »

Years ago, I though about using the 2,2 Turbo engine for my Tagora. I bought some Peugeot 505 Turbo and demounted the engine. It wasn't as nice as I wanted to have reliable unit, so I started to search for new piston set. They are bimetalic and the price is arround 1000,- Eur/set without rings. Than I closed the bonnet and sold this car to one Peugeot unthusiast  Wink It doesn't make sense to use an old and not-perfect engine for this very difficult project. But complete renovation of N9TE is a nonsense because of the prices of all.
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krede
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« Reply #19 on: October 14, 2008, 05:46:36 am »

Years ago, I though about using the 2,2 Turbo engine for my Tagora. I bought some Peugeot 505 Turbo and demounted the engine. It wasn't as nice as I wanted to have reliable unit, so I started to search for new piston set. They are bimetalic and the price is arround 1000,- Eur/set without rings. Than I closed the bonnet and sold this car to one Peugeot unthusiast  Wink It doesn't make sense to use an old and not-perfect engine for this very difficult project. But complete renovation of N9TE is a nonsense because of the prices of all.
I agree to some extend... but all engine tuning/swapping is expensive, and I would not go through the trouble of sapping and engine if I was not sure it was in good condition.

However I would (and am going to) use some of the N9TE parts for fitting a turbo on a normal murena engine instead.
And as for parts. It is now possible to have forged pistons made for less then 200 euro's a piece... and these is much stronger then the ones used by Peugeot back in the 80's
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eric
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« Reply #20 on: October 14, 2008, 05:28:27 pm »

 Wink Don't forget that the N9tea engine had a bigger oilflow threw the bearings, and the turbo needs oil too,exhaustvalve's are sodium cooled , other compression, other ignition etc ...
It is not that easy as you think to use an normal 2,2.


Eric
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michaltalbot
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« Reply #21 on: October 14, 2008, 08:34:39 pm »

yes, and also there are thin pipes between exhaust manifold and cyl.head = there is bigger diametter of all exhaust holes in the cyl.head. In the engine block, there is a special hole for oil pipe - for turbo bearings. I think that building the Turbo engine on standart 2,2 is impossible, I mean that the result will be absolutely unreliable.
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krede
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« Reply #22 on: October 14, 2008, 11:22:15 pm »

Quote
Don't forget that the N9tea engine had a bigger oilflow threw the bearings, and the turbo needs oil too
Accomplished by a different relief spring for the oil pressure...all other parts are the same.
The oil for the turbo is taken from a hole in the block that is simply plugged in the murena... an easy task drilling it out and fitting the n9te banjo bolt.

Quote
exhaustvalve's are sodium cooled
Only on the very first engines..all the later "TE" and the most powerful "TEA" engines have standard solid exhaust valves.

Quote
other compression
Hence the forged pistons.. the con rods and crank are the same.

Code:
other ignition etc

I agree with you on that point... however... my car is already fitted with fuel Injection and a programmable engine ECU.. so it will just be the matter of adding the extra couple of sensors and have it all run in again.

Quote
and also there are thin pipes between exhaust manifold and cyl.head = there is bigger diametter of all exhaust holes in the cyl.head
Indeed... I saw that on Hans's engine. I have no Idea why these pips are there, but I have heard from people using the Peugeot manifold on the murena with no proplems.. and even of murena heads used in Pug's..
I take it , thats its just a matter of grinding the recesses in the manifold down to smooth it out..should not pose any problems as all.

Quote
I mean that the result will be absolutely unreliable.
If anything the superior pistons, and better ECU programming, will make it More reliable then a standard 505TI.Pistons always seemed to be one one of the Ti's weak spots. Especially if overboosted.
And the peugeot injection was just a big bowl of spaghetti with "piggy bagging " control boxes everywhere.. just ask Matra Hans.

If done properly, I have no doubt that the standard Murena 2.2 parts, with the mentioned alterations will easily produce 200 reliable horsepowers.
If cooling/intercooling is adequate, and revs are kept below 6000/rpm
In the end its (as with every kind of tuning) a matter of being realistic, and not go too far... as is often the case... ESPECIALLY with regards to turbos.. where some people just tend to turn up the boost without any other modifications.





« Last Edit: October 14, 2008, 11:44:00 pm by krede » Logged
Oskar
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« Reply #23 on: October 15, 2008, 09:27:55 am »

ive used 3 505 turbos and on 2 of them the head cracked between 2 and 3 exhaustvalves.  This head has not diagonal cooling of the head, it comes in and out on the same side.
also the headgasket is design with larger and smaller holes to force the waterroute.  crap if I may say.
but politechnic had a nice head with smaller sparkplugholes and could get 500hp even without porting the head.  Shocked

I also think the comp is to low, 1:7.5

go for a modern engine  Wink
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eric
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« Reply #24 on: October 15, 2008, 10:47:50 am »

Yes I agree ,go for an modern engine, I have now the turbo version N9TEA,but I want an other engine.
Something more realible , like alfa V6 or VW VR6 . peugeot  MI  16.
Also the spare parts are drying up for the N9TEA.

But I have to say, when you get used to the extra power, you never want to go back
for less power, it is real kicking  when you push the trottle.


  Eric
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krede
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« Reply #25 on: October 15, 2008, 10:02:58 pm »

Yes I agree ,go for an modern engine, I have now the turbo version N9TEA,but I want an other engine.
Something more realible , like alfa V6 or VW VR6 . peugeot  MI  16.
Also the spare parts are drying up for the N9TEA.

But I have to say, when you get used to the extra power, you never want to go back
for less power, it is real kicking  when you push the trottle.


  Eric

I am aware that the engine is not flawless.. and believe me I would prefer a v6... especially the Vr6.
But for price and ease of build, The Pug Turbo is the best option... as well as its by far the least intrusive.
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