| Home  Blogs Help Search Login Register  
« previous next »
Pages: [1] 2 3 ... 5 Print
Author Topic: Sorry to the purists! Murena 2.0 !!  (Read 23583 times)
Matranut
Newbie
*
Posts: 17



« on: March 14, 2009, 02:42:52 pm »

Hi all, I havent been on the Matra Forum for a long time but finally I have my Murena on the road after over 4 years with a blown engine!
Dilemma : Do I scrap the car or fit an alternative engine? I love the car, so..........
Solution.......... fit a 2.0 Ford Zetec!
Advantage: Ford and Matra were partners in the dim and distant past so I am not being too unfaithful! Parts are easily available and best of all it has more torque and is more tuneable than the original 2.2! I currently am running the standard injection system and have dynoed at 156bhp using a Megasquirt 1 V3.0 for spark and ignition. With throttle bodies and 'hot' cams these engine are easily capable of over 200bhp. For the ultimate you could either turbo or supercharge it easily too!
Final advantage........ the insurance has come down too!
Amazingly, the engine and gearbox fits without much body modification though it IS tight!
I have used a mixture of Ford inner driveshaft couplings and Matra outboard. The Fuel tank has been custom made (approx 75 litres) and moved to the front. She passed the British MOT test  last week without any advisories on the first attempt too!
The conversion has not been cheap (probably more than the car is worth) but I intend to keep my Murena for many years so its worth it! If anyone wants the details of the engineer who did most of the work I will gladly pass his details on! Grin Happy driving ahead!!!!!!
Logged
Lennart Sorth
Administrator
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 817



WWW
« Reply #1 on: March 14, 2009, 03:50:40 pm »

Being owner of another engine transplanted Murena (XU9AJ/k Peugeot 205gti 1.9) I can't see such an operation as unfaithful at all. And as you say, Matra and Ford already are linked, so even purists should be able to read about your car without spilling their tea :-)

The most important thing is that you have got your car on the road again (congratulations at that) - and using a more modern engine with easier access to parts only helps to keep it there.

I would love to see some pictures of your car - you can either upload them in a post here, or send them to me at lennart@matrasport.dk  then I can create a separate gallery under Murena conversions (where you'll find mine here: http://www.matrasport.dk/Cars/Murena/Conv/P1.9i-8v-ls/index.html )

/Lennart
Logged

Lennart.Sorth@matrasport.dk
Murena 1983 1.9i silver // Alfa Romeo Giulietta 2.0d 2012 white // Smart 4two cdi 2010 blue //
krede
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 1166



« Reply #2 on: March 14, 2009, 05:41:19 pm »

I have no love for the standard 2.2 lump either! Smiley
I find it weak, leaky, rough and from what i hear.. prone to "blow up"... seriously... for such a small amount of cars I am amazed that so many have either blown the engine or cracked the cylinder head ( the bottom end on waldos spare parts car had completely disintegrated)   

OF CAUSE POOR MAINTENANCE has a large say in this.. but still.

My only major concerns regarding engine swaps, is the sheer amount of work involved, and whether you will be able to "undo" the "damage" at a later point.


ps: I to, would love to see some pictures of your conversion Smiley

   
Logged
Bart_Maztra
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 207



« Reply #3 on: March 14, 2009, 08:41:48 pm »

I am very curious!
I demand pictures! Wink

p.s. love your white wheels!
Logged

lewisman
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 423


« Reply #4 on: March 14, 2009, 11:54:22 pm »

Hate the white wheels Smiley and I usually hate all things F*rd  Sad but I could be easily persuaded to use a Zetec engine as a replacement for the 1960's lump in the middle of my murena!

I would like an Alfa V6 but that seems to be an even more fragile option than the 2.2!

We need pictures and details of how it was made to fit!

PS No one tell Michal Wink
Logged
Matranut
Newbie
*
Posts: 17



« Reply #5 on: March 15, 2009, 12:29:30 am »

Hi all and thanks for your interest and support - I will take some photos tomorrow and send them to you Lennart.
Logged
michaltalbot
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 566



« Reply #6 on: March 15, 2009, 09:06:54 am »

I have no love for the standard 2.2 lump either! Smiley
I find it weak, leaky, rough and from what i hear.. prone to "blow up"... seriously... for such a small amount of cars I am amazed that so many have either blown the engine or cracked the cylinder head ( the bottom end on waldos spare parts car had completely disintegrated)   
  

Blowing off the 2,2 engine has everytime only one reason - bad maintenance! When I drive my 2,2S I am using it with no mercy and very often I see my needle atacking the red zone, because my friends are using M-B SLK 55 AMG, Ford Focus ST, Nissan 350Z and Audi TT. All of them are amazed by the sound of my Matra and on our trips for karting, for meetings, etc. I really don't feel some missing power.
I understand, that some Ford, Mazda or Alfa engine will offer more power, more speed, better acceleration, but you have to understand, that with different engine it's not Matra for more, but some kind of bastard. For example: somebody will be interested by your car, you will open the engine cover and he will ask: "wow, it has the Ford Zetec?" and what you will answer? "Yes, but it's not original, I changed it, because old engine was weak..." Well what will remained in his mind? - Matra is a nice car, but needs a Ford engine to run, because original engine was a trash  Sad
I don't mind the conversion to Peugeot engine, because that is the way how it could be in possible future, but Ford, Wankel or Alfa engine in Matra? Why to hell???
Logged

Oetker
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 1048



« Reply #7 on: March 15, 2009, 11:58:07 am »

quote Michael.
----------------
Why?
=================
Answer to that is simple.
The 2.2 engine parts are possible to find, but if you revive the engine it cost you dearly.
Why not find a good alternative that has plenty of parts available?
If I leave my car sleeping, the engine will go for the next 25 year to come.
But that is not what we want, we want this beautifull car to drive!
Therefore I am always glad to see that someone comes up with a solution.

I like to have the details too Matranut.
If you want, pass them to manusie@gmail.com , I would be greatfull.
Thanks in advance

Oetker
« Last Edit: March 15, 2009, 12:00:47 pm by Oetker » Logged

I feel like Jonah, only my fish looks different.
Murena 2.2 Red 1982. Murena 1.6 black on places.
suffolkpete
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 452



« Reply #8 on: March 15, 2009, 03:21:54 pm »

Personally, I'd go for originality.  If I wanted modern sports car performance, I'd buy a modern sports car.  That said, it's much better to fit a non-original engine than see a car go off the road.  I'm intrigued as to why you chose the Ford, rather than go down the more well trodden path of the 1.9 Peugeot.  It would have given you almost as much power and probably weighs less.
Logged
Matranut
Newbie
*
Posts: 17



« Reply #9 on: March 15, 2009, 03:35:36 pm »

I agree that usually a blown engine IS due to poor maintenance however, in this case it was because I accidentally changed down too early and threw the engine to over 8000rpm! To be honest I was suprised the gearbox took the gear - unfortunately it did! Hence............ BANG! Broken piston, bent and/or snapped valves and a cracked cylinderhead! Oh the joys of track days!
Of course originality is great but I still believe it is better to keep the car on the road with the 'Matra' badge on the back so people can admire our lovely cars!

Logged
krede
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 1166



« Reply #10 on: March 15, 2009, 06:48:16 pm »

Yep... too many revs will kill an engine every time. The stresses placed upon the engine components as piston speed increases are tremendous!

And as for choice of engine?.. well..The major reason to use the pug engines is due to their inlet/exhaust/gearbox layout, that permits the fuel tank to stay in the engine compartment.... other than that..... as soon as you take an angle grinder to the chassis, originality is out the window... so in that respect the zetec is as good an engine as any.... in fact its probably a better choice than most since its so widely used in kit cars, so spares and performance parts should be readily available, and at a reasonable price.

Personally I would probably have gone for something more "exotic" If I were to make a complete swap... like the alfa v6 option... with a set of throttle bodies (for the sound)... but I am confident that a zetec is the better,faster, and much much cheaper, choice for track days and such.Smiley
As of now I am going with the pug 505 turbo engine option instead Smiley

But hats off for your work...(still wanna see those pictures), that your car passed the mot outright, suggests that you know what your are doing Smiley


ps: Don't let michal scare you... he is really a nice guy... he just loves Talbot's too much Wink
 
« Last Edit: March 15, 2009, 06:53:44 pm by krede » Logged
Matranut
Newbie
*
Posts: 17



« Reply #11 on: March 15, 2009, 10:16:47 pm »

I have sent a short write up and some photos to Lennart so hopefully he will publish them to everyone soon.
I chose the Zetec after trying the Opel/Vauxhall 2.0 Red Top (turned out to be a duff engine) and also the V6 duratec - it wont fit without serious chassis mods! In the future I will definitely move to throttlebodies and maybe, just maybe, a supercharger! The supercharger for the BMW Mini regularly come up on good old ebay and are relatively cheap too! The great thing is.... the megasquirt ignition and fuelling ECU can manage just about anything you throw at it!
my car is quite heavily modified in other areas like the interior too - I value function over form when it comes to track days - next will be polycarbonate windows!
Thanks for all your comments - good and not so good - all are welcome! Grin
Logged
Waldo
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 187

Diesel power :o)


« Reply #12 on: March 16, 2009, 11:44:11 am »

Hi Krede,

I thought the pug 1.9 engine would fit wíthout modifying the chassis?
That would be my first priority with any engine swap! Even then Alfa V6 will fit without mods to the 2.2 chassis.. even though it's tight, real tight!


And as for choice of engine?.. well..The major reason to use the pug engines is due to their inlet/exhaust/gearbox layout, that permits the fuel tank to stay in the engine compartment.... other than that..... as soon as you take an angle grinder to the chassis, originality is out the window... so in that respect the zetec is as good an engine as any.... in fact its probably a better choice than most since its so widely used in kit cars, so spares and performance parts should be readily available, and at a reasonable price.
 
Logged
Oskar
Sr. Member
****
Posts: 280



« Reply #13 on: March 16, 2009, 04:06:49 pm »

ive understand that 2.2 is more suited for rwdengine converts and 1.6 is suited for fwd engines such as the peugeot 1.9 8v or 16v.
Im thinking of doing the same, change engine to a peugeot  Undecided

and I would like som pictures to  Grin

Hi Krede,

I thought the pug 1.9 engine would fit wíthout modifying the chassis?
That would be my first priority with any engine swap! Even then Alfa V6 will fit without mods to the 2.2 chassis.. even though it's tight, real tight!


And as for choice of engine?.. well..The major reason to use the pug engines is due to their inlet/exhaust/gearbox layout, that permits the fuel tank to stay in the engine compartment.... other than that..... as soon as you take an angle grinder to the chassis, originality is out the window... so in that respect the zetec is as good an engine as any.... in fact its probably a better choice than most since its so widely used in kit cars, so spares and performance parts should be readily available, and at a reasonable price.
 
Logged

peugeot 205 gti
murena 1.6
krede
YaBB God
*****
Posts: 1166



« Reply #14 on: March 16, 2009, 04:15:57 pm »

Waldo: Yahh.. something like that.. I guess the 1.6 Murena and 1.9 pug engines share a mount point.. so the install is less trouble some.. but you tell me!! Smiley

However, my bet is that with a bit of skill you could still get a different engine into a murena without having to cut and weld..
Logged
Pages: [1] 2 3 ... 5 Print 
« previous next »
Jump to: