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Author Topic: Changing valve stem seal  (Read 1495 times)
matra530
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« Reply #15 on: February 08, 2019, 08:25:16 am »

Thats right Grin.
A pregnant wife to show that it is easy. Great idea.
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Jon Weywadt
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« Reply #16 on: March 25, 2019, 02:13:56 pm »

Watched it and it looks pretty easy.

However, what about replacing the stem seals? Once you remove the valve spring how do you pull out the old seal and replace it with a new one?

I have two types of seals.
One has a metal ring want a rubber collar surrounded by a spring.
The other is a rubber tube with a metal ring choking one end slightly and a nylon ring inserted tin the other.
I think this last type is one I got from Simons when I ordered the head gasket. Where I got the others I do not know.

The metal ones are 15,7 mm outside diameter and the hole in the rubber is 7,5 mm.
Thee rubber ones are 15,5 mm at the metal ring increasing to 16,2 mm at the end with the nylon ring. The hole in the nylon ring is 7,5 mm

Are these the correct seals and which one would work better?

Also, when doing the job with the head still mounted, do you just push the lifters to the side and does that give enough room to use the tool that Roy posted above?
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roy4matra
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« Reply #17 on: March 25, 2019, 09:56:58 pm »

Watched it and it looks pretty easy.

However, what about replacing the stem seals? Once you remove the valve spring how do you pull out the old seal and replace it with a new one?

I have two types of seals.
One has a metal ring want a rubber collar surrounded by a spring.
The other is a rubber tube with a metal ring choking one end slightly and a nylon ring inserted tin the other.
I think this last type is one I got from Simons when I ordered the head gasket. Where I got the others I do not know.

The metal ones are 15,7 mm outside diameter and the hole in the rubber is 7,5 mm.
Thee rubber ones are 15,5 mm at the metal ring increasing to 16,2 mm at the end with the nylon ring. The hole in the nylon ring is 7,5 mm

Are these the correct seals and which one would work better?

Also, when doing the job with the head still mounted, do you just push the lifters to the side and does that give enough room to use the tool that Roy posted above?

DO NOT on any account use those valve seals with the white centre sleeve in them!  There has been a warning on my website for months now.  (You should take note of things like this)  These seals are known to fail within months, and are poor quality.

The correct valve seals for the 2.2 engine are Elring 702.951 which you can obtain either from Carjoy or other motor factors. (or possibly direct).  They are usually green 'rubber' with the tiny spring around the lip seal to give the sealing tension.  Dimensions are for a 9mm valve shaft, the outer diameter of the metal part is 17mm and the inner seat diameter is 14.3mm where it fits on the top of the valve guide.

Be careful when fitting new seals over old valves that the edges of where the collets fit are not sharp, which could damage the new seals.  Strictly, you should have a thin sleeve which is fitted over the end of the valve, over which the seals slides down and are protected from the collet ridges.

Strictly the way to remove and refit valve seals is with special tools, but you can usually remove them easily enough, since there is no worry over damaging them as you will be replacing them.  To fit the new ones I often use a socket of the correct size to tap them gently down onto the guides.

Roy
« Last Edit: April 13, 2019, 10:06:38 am by roy4matra » Logged

Jon Weywadt
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« Reply #18 on: March 27, 2019, 05:25:08 pm »


DO NOT on any account use those valve seals with the white centre sleeve in them!  There has been a warning on my website for months now.  (You should take note of things like this)  These seals are known to fail within months, and are poor quality.

The correct valve seals for the 2.2 engine are Elring 702.951 which you can obtain either from Carjoy or other motor factors. (or possibly direct).  They are usually green 'rubber' with the tiny spring around the lip seal to give the sealing tension.  Dimensions are for a 9mm valve shaft, the outer diameter of the metal part is 17mm and the inner seat diameter is 14.3mm.

Strictly the way to remove and refit valve seals is with special tools, but you can usually remove them easily enough, since there is no worry over damaging them as you will be replacing them.  To fit the new ones I often use a socket of the correct size to tap them gently down onto the guides.

Roy

I was very suspicious of the seals with the white ring. It is nylon and would melt, or wear quickly,as you write.
I have found the Elring ones at a decent price. Also the Lisle tool on Amazon.com at $30.
But the other tools in the photo would be handy. In the youtube video they place a rag under the head to hold the valve up in order to replace the spring retainer. Since that is not possible in situ, putting it under pressure with compressed air using the hose seems to be the way to go. Or are there an easier way?

Regards. Jon
« Last Edit: March 28, 2019, 04:36:54 pm by Jon Weywadt » Logged

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roy4matra
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« Reply #19 on: March 28, 2019, 01:27:50 pm »


I was very suspicious of the seals with the white ring. It is nylon and would melt, or wear quickly,as you write.
I have found the Elring ones at a decent price. Also the Lisle tool on Amazon.com at $30.
But the other tools in the photo would be handy. In the youtube video they place a rag under the head to hold the valve up in order to replace the spring retainer. Since that is not possible in situ, putting it under pressure with compressed air using the hose seems to be the way to go. Or are there an easier way?

Regards. Jon

The first thing is to be aware that after the valve collets (or keepers as the Americans call them) have been in a while, they become stuck on the taper to the inside of the valve spring top retainer.  So as you try to push downwards the whole valve/retainer/collets and spring move as one.  You need to stop the valve moving so the retainer will move down it, and release the collets.  If the head is out you place something firm under the valve head, but if the head is still bolted on, then you need something inside to stop the valve moving.  But you also need to try to release the collets from the retainer.  Air pressure in the cylinder might hold the valve closed BUT only if the collets are not stuck tight on the taper to the retainer.

First bring that cylinder piston up to the top, so that the valve cannot drop inside at all, once it is released.  The top of the piston also provides a firm base on which to place something so that the closed valve is supported and cannot move downwards.  A piece of rope is often suggested as you can feed that in through the plug hole, it will curl around and form a protection for the top of the piston and provide something reasonably 'solid' to stop the valve moving down.  However, give the valve spring retainer a thump with a mallet first to break the seal between the collets and retainer.  You don't want to hit the valve itself otherwise the thump wont have the desired effect, so put a tube or socket over the top so that when you hit it, it will transfer the thump to the retainer but not touch the valve stem.  That should break the seal.  Now using the special tool you can depress the spring and retainer and the magnets should grip the collets and free the retainer.

Roy
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matra530
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« Reply #20 on: April 09, 2019, 09:03:47 am »

Roy,

you are my hero. At first Ive got the tool from the USA. In Germany it costs 50% more then the import from the US shop.
The last two weeks Ive tried to find the rigt  valve steams. But Ive found only the valve steams for the 1.6 engine. The valve steams from Simon I dont want try again...

And no I see, that you wrote the Elring part number. Great. Thanks for your good job. I will order them imediatly.

... back from my Trainingunit (a Head only). I was not able to compress the spring with the lisle tool. Even a friend of mine (120kg) and good trained managed it. The springs are to strong.

Then Ive cheked on the homepage from elring the valve steams 702.951

9    14.3    17    14.2    

The valve from the Murena is 8mm. Isnt it to wide with 9mm?

Greatings

Andreas
« Last Edit: April 09, 2019, 08:32:57 pm by matra530 » Logged
roy4matra
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« Reply #21 on: April 13, 2019, 09:54:53 am »

Roy,

you are my hero. At first Ive got the tool from the USA. In Germany it costs 50% more then the import from the US shop.
The last two weeks Ive tried to find the rigt  valve steams. But Ive found only the valve steams for the 1.6 engine. The valve steams from Simon I dont want try again...

And no I see, that you wrote the Elring part number. Great. Thanks for your good job. I will order them imediatly.

... back from my Trainingunit (a Head only). I was not able to compress the spring with the lisle tool. Even a friend of mine (120kg) and good trained managed it. The springs are to strong.

Then Ive cheked on the homepage from elring the valve steams 702.951

9    14.3    17    14.2    

The valve from the Murena is 8mm. Isnt it to wide with 9mm?

Greatings

Andreas

I'm not sure where you got your information Andreas, but the Murena 2.2 valve stems are 9 mm diameter and the seals fit perfectly.  I know as I've already used some.

If your valve stems are only 8 mm dia. they are not standard and the guides would have to have been made especially otherwise they would be too big!

As for the strength of the valve springs, they have to be strong otherwise you would get valve bounce; but again I have managed it OK.  As I stated in my last post you need to strike the retainers first to break the seal of the collets.

Roy
« Last Edit: April 13, 2019, 09:59:29 am by roy4matra » Logged

matra530
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« Reply #22 on: April 17, 2019, 09:28:07 am »

Hello Roy,

when you say, that 8,9 mm is original, than will I check it on my engine in my car. Possible, that the training head ist not original.
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