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Author Topic: Wheels and tyres  (Read 22079 times)
gizmo
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« on: June 05, 2007, 11:05:41 pm »


In another thread we are talking about the murena suspension and perhaps how to improve it but a major factor in the cars cornering power (as distinct from its handling) is the tyres. Do we stick with 14 inch rims and 60 profile tyres or fit 17 inch rims with 40 profile tyres? Of course there are various options in 15 and 16 inches also. As for tyre width, what will fit in the arches? Any recommendations for the make of tyres you are running?

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Anders Dinsen
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« Reply #1 on: June 06, 2007, 12:03:57 pm »

I have found that the Murena likes soft, sticky compounds and based on that I went for Yokohamas that has a reputation for being soft and grippy. Yokohama's generally score well in various tests, though they wear significantly faster than competitors.

But since wear rate and grip are in principle reversely correlated, I find that to be an indication of their uncompromised grippy nature Wink

And so far (running some 700 km on different roads) I am very satisfied with them! They don't oversteer, understeer or loose grip at all. Their limit is much further out than mine. Only on the very wet do they seem to set a limit (tendency to understeer), but that is acceptible. I think my winter tyres will be doing better then.

My front tyre size is non-standard, being a 55-profile instead of a 60. This is what Roy Gillard recommends strongly. I have never tried the 60 profile, though.

In the Yokohama case I had to accept different tyre patterns - the fronts are "S.drive", while the rears are "C.drive". S stands for "Sport", while "C" for comfort. So you can probably imagine that the carcass on the on the 55's is much stiffer than on the rears.

I just went to have the front wheels rebalanced because of vibration > 100 km/h. They are now far better, but when the mechanic and I worked with them we noticed that the rims are not perfectly round. Both front rims have been deformed a few mm which unfortunately means that they will never be perfect. These are the original rims.

It's a pity really, because had I known this I would have bought a pair of 15 inch rims and fitted 50-profile tyres on it with 195's on the front and 205's on the rear (i.e. 10 mm wider than standard), but now that I have the new tyres (and like them), I will probably buy myself a pair of new 14 inch rims in a design that matches the car.

I have been told to avoid Firestone's by the way, as they are simply too hard and will never perform well on the Murena.

- Anders
« Last Edit: June 06, 2007, 12:07:51 pm by Anders Dinsen » Logged

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gizmo
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« Reply #2 on: June 06, 2007, 10:52:16 pm »


Interesting coments, I had yokohama's on my mx5 (185/60 x 14) and agree they are a good tyre, however I have recently changed the wheels and tyres for 17 inch rims and 205/40  budget tyres. The logic behind this is the 17's look better in the wheel arches and the car is rarely driven hard so grip was not a priority. Let's face facts the mx5 is really for posing on sunny days, and it's used mainly by my wife. I was of course expecting all of the undesirable side effects like poor ride quality adverse steering feedback etc. imagine my surprise to find the car is actually better than before, logic tells me it should be worse but no it really is improved and even my wife agrees. Explanations welcome.

On the subject of changing rims, on the murena using wobble bolts will allow the fitment of rims with 100x4 stud spacings and these wheels are much more common and cheaper and better still for me is that I have 3 other cars which use this stud pattern so I will be able to swap wheels and compare the different sizes without any extra expense (although I might need to buy a few pairs of axel stands).

I concur with your comment on firestone's, I had them on an MGB and they were bad, they were replaced by michelin XAS which were fantastic. Of course it's always dangerous to compare tyres when they are not fitted to the same type of car, I liked goodyears on a previous car but I'm not impressed with the goodyears on the mr2. Unlike the mx5 which rarely goes over 120kmph the mr2 rarely goes under 120kmph.

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« Reply #3 on: June 07, 2007, 11:25:15 am »

Interesting coments, I had yokohama's on my mx5 (185/60 x 14) and agree they are a good tyre, however I have recently changed the wheels and tyres for 17 inch rims and 205/40  budget tyres. The logic behind this is the 17's look better in the wheel arches and the car is rarely driven hard so grip was not a priority. Let's face facts the mx5 is really for posing on sunny days, and it's used mainly by my wife. I was of course expecting all of the undesirable side effects like poor ride quality adverse steering feedback etc. imagine my surprise to find the car is actually better than before, logic tells me it should be worse but no it really is improved and even my wife agrees. Explanations welcome.

New tyres are always better than old and with my own problems with irregular rims in mind, it may also be that your new rims are more circular than the old ones. Balancing could also be better on the new ones.

Quote
On the subject of changing rims, on the murena using wobble bolts will allow the fitment of rims with 100x4 stud spacings and these wheels are much more common and cheaper and better still for me is that I have 3 other cars which use this stud pattern so I will be able to swap wheels and compare the different sizes without any extra expense (although I might need to buy a few pairs of axel stands).

Until Krede, and now you mentioned them, I didn't know about the existence of wobble bolts. Are they really useful?

Quote
Unlike the mx5 which rarely goes over 120kmph the mr2 rarely goes under 120kmph.

Is it the first generation MR2?
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gizmo
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« Reply #4 on: June 07, 2007, 02:33:58 pm »


New tyres are always better than old and with my own problems with irregular rims in mind, it may also be that your new rims are more circular than the old ones. Balancing could also be better on the new ones.

The yokohama's (A460's) were less than half worn and the rims are not old as the car has only done 12,000km. As mentioned they were really changed just for the look of the larger wheels.

Quote
Until Krede, and now you mentioned them, I didn't know about the existence of wobble bolts. Are they really useful?

Read the advert and decide for yourself: They come in most lengths and thread sizes.




Quote
Is it the first generation MR2?

Yes, a mk1b



I will try the yokohama's on the mr2 to compare them to the present goodyears.

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« Reply #5 on: June 07, 2007, 02:51:38 pm »

Thats a nice Toyota that is!! Smiley
And look!!.. a sportscar DOES look good in white Wink
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lewisman
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« Reply #6 on: June 07, 2007, 08:47:01 pm »

White is the new black!

Don't forget that although Fiat/Alfa use the same pcd on their wheels, the bolts have a different thread.

You can also get a kit to replace the bolts with studs.  Makes it easier to replace the wheels but otherwise no difference.
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« Reply #7 on: June 07, 2007, 08:53:31 pm »

Don't forget that although Fiat/Alfa use the same pcd on their wheels, the bolts have a different thread.

Yes, thank you for reminding us!
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lewisman
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« Reply #8 on: June 07, 2007, 09:29:52 pm »

More proof that sportscars can look good in white Cool



I should have kept it.......
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gizmo
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« Reply #9 on: June 08, 2007, 12:20:41 am »


Don't forget that although Fiat/Alfa use the same pcd on their wheels, the bolts have a different thread.

These wobble bolts come in every length and thread combination you could ask for, the Alfa advert was just an example to show one of the companies who supply them.

Yes lewisman the baggy looks nice in white, you really should  have kept it.

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lewisman
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« Reply #10 on: June 08, 2007, 01:16:44 am »

A lot of the wobble bolts are sold for Alfas and Fiats because they use the same 98mm pcd unlike the rest which are mostly either 100mm (they are the ones of interest to us) or 108mm.  I didn't doubt you would know all about the thread issue, just that others might not remember to check.

The white Baggy was quite nice when I sold it.  It was right hand drive and it had a 1.6 Solara engine.  I had to sell it to start building a house!

Unfortunately it was sold on ebay last year for £350 in a sorry state.   Sad  I almost bought it but for once the heart ruled the head. The thought of cutting out all of the welding that I did in the late 80's to do it all over again was enough to put me off.

Luckily the murena came up.  Probably needs as much work on the engine, interior and paintwork but at least it has a good chassis.

I have a few sets of spare alloys so have a choice of either 14" standard, 15" five spoke TSW, 16" Momo Arrows or (if I steal them off the wife's Alfa) 17" Momo five spoke alloys to try out on the murena.  (The least likely will be the 14" standard alloys which will no doubt end up on fleabay.)  I suspect the 17s would need to have different offsets front and rear. Not sure about the Arrows but the 15" TSWs look good on.
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Lennart Sorth
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« Reply #11 on: June 23, 2007, 02:16:17 am »

More proof that sportscars can look good in white Cool
nice!

Yes, you should have kept it, - but I'm sure you had good reason to part with it then.


On the topic of alloys, I use 15" Azev-A for summer driving, and when I bought them, the company simply asked for the offset, pcd and center hole diam - then they drilled the holes and balanced the  alloy.  I *think* I spoke to the German main company directly, but I could be wrong. It is 11 years ago.


/Lennart
« Last Edit: July 01, 2007, 11:34:11 pm by Lennart Sorth » Logged

Lennart.Sorth@matrasport.dk
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« Reply #12 on: June 28, 2007, 11:08:24 am »

Can i fit a 15 inch rims with  60 - 205 tyres in the front and in the back have anyone tried it , or should i stick to 14 inch , i would really like to put on 205 because i hate sport cars with thin tyres
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Anders Dinsen
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« Reply #13 on: June 28, 2007, 12:26:46 pm »

Can i fit a 15 inch rims with  60 - 205 tyres in the front and in the back have anyone tried it , or should i stick to 14 inch , i would really like to put on 205 because i hate sport cars with thin tyres

The correct sizes on 15" rims are

front:  195/50R15
rear: 205/50R15

Lennart runs on that and is happy with it. It also looks good.

Don't fit the same width front and rear as you won't get the correct balance between front and rear. Also be careful to get the typre pressures right!

- Anders Cool
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Laurens
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« Reply #14 on: June 28, 2007, 06:20:42 pm »

i am very satified with toyo proxis t1 r

205-50-15 and 225-50-15 on 15 inch wrd mesh 7j and 8j rims.

i have koni in the front and rear. with shortened 2.2 springs in the rear.

i have a 1.6

handling is very addicting.
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