Hi all!

[Matra_Hans]

Anders wrote
"Peugeot tuned that very engine block and head to more than 400 HP in the 505 turbo for rally versions".

Actualy the latest version the 505 Turbo used for track racing developed by Danielsen had 575 HP.

Otherwise I agree with Anders: Install aother cam. There are several possibilities S-cam, 152 CV cam, Maxi-Route or Holbay.
But a new cam is not cheap. 10 years ago I paid more than 6000 DKK for a 152 CV cam. Including a new carburator, stainless 4-in-1 exhaust the total invoice for parts was 16.000 DKK.
(my wife do not read the Matra forum)

Hans

[Anders Dinsen]

575 HP.... that's a LOT! 

It looks like Politecnic is a bit cheaper and lists a hot cam at around 650 EUR including french VAT, but you'll need new followers of course, and my french isn't good enough to spot them in their price list... oh, yes... "culbuteurs" I don't know what the price of the Holbay is. I think Politecnic may also be able to reground a cam profile.

My wife don't read the forum either, but she checks the bank account! 

[Matra_Hans]

Regarding S-cam: There is actualy a machine shop somwhere in Denmark that has the "model" to grind a S-profile on a standard cam.

Hans

[RazorbackNOR]

Yes, seems like turbo has potensiale, but also lots of work... Anders, how many hours work will it be to change the cam? How about changing carbs? from what i could tell, converting to injection doesnt give any boost in hp.


Porting/changing inlet/oulet manifold without changing cam, does that improve anything?

Too much winding roads if you ask me..... At least in the Opel stationwagon....

[Anders Dinsen]

Yes, seems like turbo has potensiale, but also lots of work... Anders, how many hours work will it be to change the cam? How about changing carbs? from what i could tell, converting to injection doesnt give any boost in hp.

Sidedraughths (Weber or Dellorto's) won't give you much on the torque, but should give you something on the top - but is that what you need? I wouldn't start tuning on the standard cam, however. It's only 256 degrees period (inlet) so if you want increased volumetric efficiency (i.e. power/litre) with that, I think you will need to blow the air into the cylinder using a super charger or turbo.

The S-cam has 279 degrees of inlet period. That's a decent tuning cam, but the Holbay is up to 296 and 76 degrees of overlap. This cam should have a lot of potential, but seen from the point of view of the DIY tuner on a budget, it's an excellent choice because it runs so well on the unmodified engine. Idle is rough of course, but not badly, and it works well even on the standard induction (single carb and standard manifold) and on an unported head. The exhaust is probably more important, as the rapidly moving exhaust gasses help start the induction early due to the overlap. A camshaft tuning book I have says that 290+ degrees are chosen when mid-range power is needed, which is just what we want on a road going Murena - and I can confirm that it does enhance the mid-range. The engine runs smoothly, but not aggressively at 1500-2500 rpm, but from 3000 it really starts to work, and at 3500 it's *very* torquey and revs freely past 6000+ rpm.

If I need a really fast start, I have to rev it up to 4500 in 1st. Remember the Murena has a lot of weight on the rear wheels, and the grip will rapidly increase with acceleration - so it's just very difficult to spin the wheels. This is nothing like your daily front wheel driver!! Most of the time, however, I enjoy an easy start in 1st, but floor it when it reaches 3000 rpm in 2nd. The sound and acceleration usually causes my smile to extend all the way to my ears!

Porting/changing inlet/oulet manifold without changing cam, does that improve anything?

Probably not, no.

Too much winding roads if you ask me..... At least in the Opel stationwagon....

I have ONE thing to say: When you buy the Murena you will start LOVING the winding roads! Even those with speed limits. There's just SO much fun in that car.

[michaltalbot]

There's just SO much fun in that car.

Where can I subscribe this?

[Lennart Sorth]

Too much winding roads if you ask me..... At least in the Opel stationwagon....

You don't necessarily need more power to enjoy a Murena, - a winding road is enough:

http://www.matrasport.dk/Cars/Murena/Stories/ls_twisty_roads01.html

The little I have been driving in Norway tells me that you have some spectacular roads - and since you are burdened with similar speed-limits as in Denmark, the trick is to get a sporty car that doesn't need to be going at 200+ km/h to feel alive - and the Murena is just that.

/Lennart

[RazorbackNOR]

A camshaft tuning book I have says that 290+ degrees are chosen when mid-range power is needed, which is just what we want on a road going Murena - and I can confirm that it does enhance the mid-range. The engine runs.....

Hmm, now there is a book a could feast my eyes on.... Which book is this Anders, and is it hard to come by?

[krede]

Razor: If legislations in your country allow it, and you have the technical knowlage, go for a turbo!.
the 505 turbo engine is easy to fit, and will give you 180-200hp on standard parts without much fuss.

If you want to use the engine you already have, you can use some of the parts from the 505 anyway, especially the inlet, and exhaust manifolds are usefull.
The 9,45:1 cr of the standard 2.2 should be able to cope with some mild boost if properly set up and intercooled.
Look in the vault.. theres an artichle about a turbo murena... it uses the standard parts (even the carb.. though re-jetted)

If you want 160+ hp in a street murena.. a turbo (in my mind) is the only practical way to go.

[Anders Dinsen]

A camshaft tuning book I have says that 290+ degrees are chosen when mid-range power is needed, which is just what we want on a road going Murena - and I can confirm that it does enhance the mid-range. The engine runs.....

Hmm, now there is a book a could feast my eyes on.... Which book is this Anders, and is it hard to come by?

Veloce publishing, SpeedPro Series: How to choose camshafts & time them for maximum power. Author: Des Hammil. The guy has written a whole range of books on engine tuning. I've bought mine from Amazon.co.uk

[RazorbackNOR]

Hello everybody.

New norwegian to the forum.

I'm considering buying b-havers Murena here in Norway. Just the usual wife problem and some moral dilemmas to...

BAD NEWS!!

Went to look at the car on saturday, and got a mail from him today that the car was now sold. To bad, cause the car was in EXCELLENT condition, paint almost perfect, and ultra low milage.

Will be sad many days now....    

[michaltalbot]

Somebody was faster... But luckily there is still a lot of opportunities to buy a Murena, so next time You must be faster 

[RazorbackNOR]

yes, had some trouble getting the cash, and that was a once in a lifetime offer i think, considering the state of the car and the cost. have seen some others, but with atleast 2x the distance traveled, 2x the price and all to offen 2x the price in import tax 

[RazorbackNOR]

Hello everybody.

New norwegian to the forum.

I'm considering buying b-havers Murena here in Norway. Just the usual wife problem and some moral dilemmas to...

Well, people, you are now looking at the new owner of a golden 83 model Murena
Just got of the phone with the man to confirm the buy.

[Oetker]

Congratiulations, and welcome to the happy few that has one.
Any pics yet?