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Author Topic: Murena Engine Rebuild  (Read 10592 times)
GP
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« on: February 16, 2011, 06:41:45 pm »

Due to the excess of oil pouring out of the crankcase seals and a gradual increase in knocking noise that made me err on the cautionary side and call out a recovery truck  Sad I have now removed my engine and delivered it to Roy Gillard for a full refurbish and oil tight (as possible) rebuild.
The last rebuild was done in 1998, so I am very interested to find out if the engine was actually put together properly then and what the damage or wear is now, if any?
One thing that is obvious is that No. 3 exhaust manifold was leaking due to the burnt paint  on the block, so I will resurface the exhaust pipe manifold flanges amongst other jobs in preparation to reinstalling the engine.

NB: The last thing I touched before lowering the engine out was the distributor and I found this to be loose on the pinch bolt. So I am hoping with all fingers and toes crossed that it was purely an ignition timing problem causing the noise.

Will keep you posted on developments and if you Roy wish to give any feedback direct feel free.

GP
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Oetker
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« Reply #1 on: February 17, 2011, 01:18:20 am »

Things that happen sometimes Tongue




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I feel like Jonah, only my fish looks different.
Murena 2.2 Red 1982. Murena 1.6 black on places.
GP
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« Reply #2 on: February 17, 2011, 07:39:21 pm »

Ooh errr.....  I don't think I will be able to sleep tonight?
I don't want to see any more sights like that thanks!

GP
« Last Edit: February 17, 2011, 07:43:11 pm by GP » Logged
Oetker
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« Reply #3 on: February 17, 2011, 07:55:49 pm »

I also have some interesting pics of main bearings and crancks, but  I don't want to disturbe youre sleep anymore.
Let's hope for the best, and it is only the ignition gear.
They are very soft and easy worn out.
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I feel like Jonah, only my fish looks different.
Murena 2.2 Red 1982. Murena 1.6 black on places.
suffolkpete
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« Reply #4 on: February 17, 2011, 08:03:34 pm »

I think it's lasted very well considering the use you put it to. Wink  I hope you are planning to get it balanced during the rebuild, it's not a huge amount of money in the general scheme of things and makes a big difference.
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macaroni
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Murena and Multipla - I like it 3 abreast!


« Reply #5 on: March 02, 2011, 08:58:59 am »

Hope it goes well Graham and I look forward to another dice around Brands in my 205 when its all back together.
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GP
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« Reply #6 on: March 03, 2011, 10:04:55 pm »

Hope it goes well Graham and I look forward to another dice around Brands in my 205 when its all back together.
Engine strip down has revealed a blown head gasket between 3 & 4 cylinders. Hopefully the head will not require a skim, but have to wait and see? Roy has identified the cause as probably due to me not re-torquing the head after a 1000 miles after the previous rebuild, as the head bolts were pretty loose. Regardless I have ordered a Mecapart 505 Turbo ROC Head Gasket which will be used on the rebuild.
There is excess end float on the crank which will hopefully be cured by new thrust washers.
The rear block seal was fitted badly and plastic pegs were not used, hence all the oil pouring out.
Two of the pistons had the ring gaps in the same places.
And last but not least all the Rocker Arms were Inlet Arms! So a new or reground set of exhaust Rocker Arms with the lubrication hole are required. New ones orderd and on their way.
Brands Hatch will definitely be on the cards for a Track Day, but the first target is "La Vie en Blue" Hillclimb at Prescott and Crystal Palace Sprint at the end of May.

G.P.
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suffolkpete
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« Reply #7 on: March 03, 2011, 10:16:03 pm »

Quote
And last but not least all the Rocker Arms were Inlet Arms!
  I hope you caught it before it trashed the camshaft.
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GP
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« Reply #8 on: March 04, 2011, 08:23:42 am »

Quote
And last but not least all the Rocker Arms were Inlet Arms!
  I hope you caught it before it trashed the camshaft.

Roy thinks I got away with it due to the quality engine oil I use, which is Millers Motorsport CSS 20w50 Competition Semi Synthetic Oil for older performance engines.
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michaltalbot
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« Reply #9 on: March 13, 2011, 07:35:14 pm »

If I can recomend something - use the Peugeot 2,2 Turbo Injection head gasket  Wink I do it with every overhaul of this 2,2 engine.
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GP
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« Reply #10 on: March 13, 2011, 08:17:44 pm »

If I can recomend something - use the Peugeot 2,2 Turbo Injection head gasket  Wink I do it with every overhaul of this 2,2 engine.

Understood, I will be doing this. What supplier do you use for these and how much would you expect to pay in Euro?

G.P.
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michaltalbot
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« Reply #11 on: March 15, 2011, 12:26:53 am »

That's the question... because all parts for my 2,2 rebuilds (once in my 2,2 Tagora, three times in my old silver 2,2 Murena and now second time for my red 2,2 S) I bought from Milan Dobes here in CZ, but think that it's Elring, surely not Ajusa (from Spain). Price as I remember was arround 60,- Eur. On my Tagora, I did more than 350.000 kms after renovation, both my Murenas were used for racing on circuit and I never had problems with this gaskets not even when I overheated it (on my silver 2,2 - once due to bad cooler what caused breaking of cyl.head and second time when that welded head broke again - stupid me, because using the welded head is just for selling the car, not for longer use - it broke down right at the point of welding Roll Eyes ). Even my last problem on 2,2 S caused overheating the engine, but head did resists also as the turbo gasket Wink Milan Dobes allways says that I am a test driver for quality of his repairs and when I need the cyl.head gasket, he automaticaly takes the Turbo gasket  Grin
For refresh - I bought my Murena 5 years ago with completely damaged engine, one piston missing (broken to small pieces), big hole in cylinder, damaged head and crankshaft too. We rebuilded the engine, but I haven't checked the ballancing of flywheel. After some kms, the oil started to leak between engine and gearbox, cca 1 liter per 5000kms. I used the car and though that some day, I have to make new sealing of crankcase. One hot day at circuit I forgot to fill up the oil and also (because of a hard race with new Subaru Impreza hatchback) I "forgot" to gear up and saw my rewmeter in 7000 rpm sometimes. Three laps the Subaru wasn't able to overtake me, in corners I was better (but true is, that I have polyurethan bushes on both antiroll bars, Spax suspension, 205/50R15 and 215/45R15 Toyo TR1, lightened engine cover and better set up on front axle), on straight parts he was faster of course... than I heard that fu**ing knocking Sad At first, I though that only one small-end bearing was wrong, and after demounting the engine, it really was, but also my last main bearing was damaged very very hardly - it was not only from last time, it was the result of unbalanced flywheel and also that was the way where the oil went off. Is known that 5 grams of unbalancing is a problem - I had 16 grams on flywheel, 8 grams on one side of the crankshaft and 7 grams on the other side... I though that from factory it must be balanced, but probably the previous owner used the flywheel from other engine. After balancing it, there was cca 0,15 grams on flywheel, 0,17 g on one side and 0,18 grams on other side of the crankshaft. Now I have driven cca 900 kms and I have to say, that engine runs much more smoothly and more willingly follows the throttle pedal, I'm not going over 4000 rpm, but when I press the pedal a little, it goes really very quicky up and after gearing up, there is no delay, it's just accelerating more and more, I couldn't image what will happend when I will go over 4000 rpm where this engine starts showing its power  Wink now I'm very very satisfied and it's surprising because before the car wasn't slowly.


« Last Edit: March 15, 2011, 12:33:47 pm by michaltalbot » Logged

Oskar
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« Reply #12 on: March 15, 2011, 08:12:10 pm »

I got the n9tea head gasket from peugeot for around 65euros.
maybe politechnic has some left?
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peugeot 205 gti
murena 1.6
GP
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« Reply #13 on: April 21, 2011, 12:27:10 am »

Well I picked up the engine several weeks ago from Roy.  Whilst there Roy pointed out damage on the sump, which indicated it was hitting the chassis on the offside (right) front side. On inspection the lower engine bushes were collapsed on both sides, with the holes nearer the bottom than the middle. So new bushes were fitted, along with a new clutch assembly and the bearing on the end of the crankshaft before re-installing the engine in the car.

The biggest job so far has been painstakingly re-dressing the exhaust manifold flanges by hand, with a file and a sheet of 6mm mirrored glass coated with grinding paste, to remove the errosion and pitting which was very bad on all four pipe flange areas.

I am lucky enough to have aquired the whole engine assembly from the Matra Honda conversion done in the U.K.  by Darren. On the engine he had some lovely stainlees steel cooling pipes made up by a talented F1 fabricator friend of his. I hope to have these all fitted shortly, followed by the suspension and then fire the beast up. Keep you posted. Brmm Brmm!  Cheesy

GP
« Last Edit: April 21, 2011, 05:45:50 pm by GP » Logged
Oetker
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« Reply #14 on: April 22, 2011, 12:17:49 pm »

You placed a aftermarket engine-mount if I see it correct.
They have harder compound.
Since I have this on the car I have some extra vibrations at idle, and if mounted wrong also a rumble in higher RPM.
It is irritating.
Looking at youre sump there must have been a lot of movement.
Something like in this video.
In this video you can also see how a engine dies when forgetting oil-check.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mLNzBDYfIII
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I feel like Jonah, only my fish looks different.
Murena 2.2 Red 1982. Murena 1.6 black on places.
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